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	<title>Comments on: No wonder atheists make fun of Christians</title>
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	<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/</link>
	<description>Lon's diatribes and rants on politics, religion, and geek stuff.</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2012 06:21:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Blog me up, Buttercups &#124; Prose Before Hos</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-429</link>
		<dc:creator>Blog me up, Buttercups &#124; Prose Before Hos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 22:00:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-429</guid>
		<description>[...] 6. No wonder we make fun of Christians. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 6. No wonder we make fun of Christians. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mark T.</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-136</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark T.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 18:32:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-136</guid>
		<description>Yes this is why they make fun of Christians. It's also why they make fun of black people, but you don't have the testicles to say that, now, do you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes this is why they make fun of Christians. It&#8217;s also why they make fun of black people, but you don&#8217;t have the testicles to say that, now, do you?</p>
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		<title>By: rasnsasnberry</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-123</link>
		<dc:creator>rasnsasnberry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:17:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-123</guid>
		<description>This is a good conversation.  however i would like to add this. In Matthew 5:22 Jesus reveals a truth to us.  this truth applies to all people, Christians and non-christens.  and it is a window into the love Jesus had for all mankind.  this is the love he wanted everyone to express.  Every teaching in the bible is there not to try to put us down and tell us we are failures.  his teachings are there to protect us from ourselves.  so that we don't destroy ourselves and those around us.  Matthew 5:22 says: "But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, 'You good-for-nothing,' shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, 'You fool,' shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell."  why does Jesus tell us this.  simple, calling others fools can destroy their love and spirit, it can harden others against us, and us against others.  if your opinions are such that others seem foolish to you then it is time to repent and be forgiven.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a good conversation.  however i would like to add this. In Matthew 5:22 Jesus reveals a truth to us.  this truth applies to all people, Christians and non-christens.  and it is a window into the love Jesus had for all mankind.  this is the love he wanted everyone to express.  Every teaching in the bible is there not to try to put us down and tell us we are failures.  his teachings are there to protect us from ourselves.  so that we don&#8217;t destroy ourselves and those around us.  Matthew 5:22 says: &#8220;But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, &#8216;You good-for-nothing,&#8217; shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, &#8216;You fool,&#8217; shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.&#8221;  why does Jesus tell us this.  simple, calling others fools can destroy their love and spirit, it can harden others against us, and us against others.  if your opinions are such that others seem foolish to you then it is time to repent and be forgiven.</p>
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		<title>By: xoc</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-105</link>
		<dc:creator>xoc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Dec 2007 06:03:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-105</guid>
		<description>Why does one person grow up to be a fundamentalists and another a moderate? 9 times out of 10, it is the community they grew up in. People take on the religion and culture that they are born into. It is extremely rare for a child of evangelicals to decide to be a catholic. It is even rarer for the child of protestants to grow up and convert islam. And yet everyone is absolutely convinced their particular religion has a monopoly on the truth. I guess everyone thinks they are 'blessed by God' more than everyone else, so God made their parents believe in the one true religion! They never seem to question why God would allow innocent children to be born to families who worship a fictional god.

The fundamentalists are no more arrogant about this than the moderates. The only difference is that the fundamentalists make more of an attempt to follow their teachings. Moderates tend to inject a dose of reason and scepticism into their beliefs (to a point). Moderates will argue that the fundamentalists pervert the teachings, but then the fundamentalists believe the same thing about the moderates.

The fundamentalist ideas are ludicrous in the extreme, and there is no point trying to reason with people who are so out of touch with reality. The moderates however have shown some capacity to think for themselves. There is hope that one day they will find the courage to truly examine the nature of their religion (and religion in general). The inconsistencies, contradictions and blatant implausibility of all religions are written in black and white throughout the holy texts - just waiting there for those with the courage  and willingness to apply dispassionate reason to set themselves free.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why does one person grow up to be a fundamentalists and another a moderate? 9 times out of 10, it is the community they grew up in. People take on the religion and culture that they are born into. It is extremely rare for a child of evangelicals to decide to be a catholic. It is even rarer for the child of protestants to grow up and convert islam. And yet everyone is absolutely convinced their particular religion has a monopoly on the truth. I guess everyone thinks they are &#8216;blessed by God&#8217; more than everyone else, so God made their parents believe in the one true religion! They never seem to question why God would allow innocent children to be born to families who worship a fictional god.</p>
<p>The fundamentalists are no more arrogant about this than the moderates. The only difference is that the fundamentalists make more of an attempt to follow their teachings. Moderates tend to inject a dose of reason and scepticism into their beliefs (to a point). Moderates will argue that the fundamentalists pervert the teachings, but then the fundamentalists believe the same thing about the moderates.</p>
<p>The fundamentalist ideas are ludicrous in the extreme, and there is no point trying to reason with people who are so out of touch with reality. The moderates however have shown some capacity to think for themselves. There is hope that one day they will find the courage to truly examine the nature of their religion (and religion in general). The inconsistencies, contradictions and blatant implausibility of all religions are written in black and white throughout the holy texts - just waiting there for those with the courage  and willingness to apply dispassionate reason to set themselves free.</p>
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		<title>By: Lon</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-103</link>
		<dc:creator>Lon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Dec 2007 02:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-103</guid>
		<description>Now that the main reddit "whoosh" is over, allow me to give some responses:

&lt;b&gt;@Mike&lt;/b&gt;: Very insightful comment, although I believe you're being generous by thinking that Sherri meant that. Possibly so, however. Not a bad blog you have too.

&lt;b&gt;@Roach&lt;/b&gt;: I'll have to disagree that mainline and liberal Christians keep quiet about the idiotic fundamentalists because they somehow agree with them deep down. As you said, critical thinking is hard; you may wish to work on that some more. Indeed, saying "Believing in Jesus is easy" shows very clearly how little you know about it. Regurgitating sound bites is what is easy.

&lt;b&gt;@Dave&lt;/b&gt;: I'm not sure that lack of a forum is the real reason mainstream and liberal Christians don't dispute fundamentalists with more vigor. I see the reason as more likely being a mixture of laziness and the old cliche "Never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and the pig likes it". Arguing with any fundamentalist is very similar to arguing with some atheists. Not only does it disrupt your own peace, but they like it.

&lt;b&gt;@Ember&lt;/b&gt;: There's that too. :)

&lt;b&gt;@Valerie&lt;/b&gt;: Agreed. Also, nice site you have. While I don't agree with everything there (female modesty is sooo overrated *grin*), I don't disagree with everything there either, and there's a whole lot of goodness within your pages. Keep up the good work. BTW, if you see this...where did you get your banner pic? I find it strangely erotic. *cough*

&lt;b&gt;@turtle&lt;/b&gt; and &lt;b&gt;sanityman&lt;/b&gt;: Be careful, you apparently have just as much a need for education as Ms. Shepherd.

&lt;b&gt;@Jerry&lt;/b&gt;: My agreement with your comment will come as no surprise.

Many thanks to all who have dropped by to comment. If you stick around, I'm sure we'll find further things to agree, disagree, debate, or argue about!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now that the main reddit &#8220;whoosh&#8221; is over, allow me to give some responses:</p>
<p><b>@Mike</b>: Very insightful comment, although I believe you&#8217;re being generous by thinking that Sherri meant that. Possibly so, however. Not a bad blog you have too.</p>
<p><b>@Roach</b>: I&#8217;ll have to disagree that mainline and liberal Christians keep quiet about the idiotic fundamentalists because they somehow agree with them deep down. As you said, critical thinking is hard; you may wish to work on that some more. Indeed, saying &#8220;Believing in Jesus is easy&#8221; shows very clearly how little you know about it. Regurgitating sound bites is what is easy.</p>
<p><b>@Dave</b>: I&#8217;m not sure that lack of a forum is the real reason mainstream and liberal Christians don&#8217;t dispute fundamentalists with more vigor. I see the reason as more likely being a mixture of laziness and the old cliche &#8220;Never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and the pig likes it&#8221;. Arguing with any fundamentalist is very similar to arguing with some atheists. Not only does it disrupt your own peace, but they like it.</p>
<p><b>@Ember</b>: There&#8217;s that too. <img src='http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p><b>@Valerie</b>: Agreed. Also, nice site you have. While I don&#8217;t agree with everything there (female modesty is sooo overrated *grin*), I don&#8217;t disagree with everything there either, and there&#8217;s a whole lot of goodness within your pages. Keep up the good work. BTW, if you see this&#8230;where did you get your banner pic? I find it strangely erotic. *cough*</p>
<p><b>@turtle</b> and <b>sanityman</b>: Be careful, you apparently have just as much a need for education as Ms. Shepherd.</p>
<p><b>@Jerry</b>: My agreement with your comment will come as no surprise.</p>
<p>Many thanks to all who have dropped by to comment. If you stick around, I&#8217;m sure we&#8217;ll find further things to agree, disagree, debate, or argue about!</p>
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		<title>By: ElTigre</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-99</link>
		<dc:creator>ElTigre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Dec 2007 15:34:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-99</guid>
		<description>@sanityman

To each his own, man. I'm sorry to hear that you think I'm foolish/delusional/without a fully functioning brain, but I don't have a problem with you having your own opinion.

Happy Holidays!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@sanityman</p>
<p>To each his own, man. I&#8217;m sorry to hear that you think I&#8217;m foolish/delusional/without a fully functioning brain, but I don&#8217;t have a problem with you having your own opinion.</p>
<p>Happy Holidays!</p>
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		<title>By: Jerry</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-98</link>
		<dc:creator>Jerry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Dec 2007 15:20:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-98</guid>
		<description>All moderate people of faith must be encouraged to confront the extremists in their religion.   If anyone else does it they will, rightly, be accused of being non-believers and their message of moderation will be lost in cacophony if righteous indignation.  Fundamentalism is BAD it separates people from the real world that G** made for us to  live in and spins them into a theoretical world of 'what G** wants'.  He wants us to live together, in peace, and to understand/appreciate the diversity He provided.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All moderate people of faith must be encouraged to confront the extremists in their religion.   If anyone else does it they will, rightly, be accused of being non-believers and their message of moderation will be lost in cacophony if righteous indignation.  Fundamentalism is BAD it separates people from the real world that G** made for us to  live in and spins them into a theoretical world of &#8216;what G** wants&#8217;.  He wants us to live together, in peace, and to understand/appreciate the diversity He provided.</p>
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		<title>By: ElTigre</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-95</link>
		<dc:creator>ElTigre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Dec 2007 01:34:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-95</guid>
		<description>@Lon

Well put. Folks who play the Christian card during an introduction or shortly thereafter downright scare me. It's kind of the same feeling I get when a perfect stranger wants to strike up a conversation with me about business and what I do for a living. I know that they'll eventually tell me they own their own business and then make on offer to share with me what they do and how I can be a part of it. My approach to "witnessing", is to befriend everyone I meet, treat them with the respect and love that I know Christ would, and make myself available to help them if the need arises. That can be extending an invitation to help someone move or listening to someone tell me about the hard times they're going through without trying to offer unwanted counsel. I really really look forward to the "letting out of bad blood" in the American Christian Church. What I mean by that is for those who are going to make a commitment to make it, but those who are not to be honest enough with themselves to admit that.  My best friends are not die-hard Christians. One is a stout atheist, but I love him, because he's so honest it's nothing short of refreshing. I would love to see church leadership just be honest about themselves. The people would follow suit. Instead we struggle to maintain the facade and it fools no one. We are no holier or better than the rest of society. That's what I truly love about Christianity. It doesn't demand perfection. It doesn't demand performance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Lon</p>
<p>Well put. Folks who play the Christian card during an introduction or shortly thereafter downright scare me. It&#8217;s kind of the same feeling I get when a perfect stranger wants to strike up a conversation with me about business and what I do for a living. I know that they&#8217;ll eventually tell me they own their own business and then make on offer to share with me what they do and how I can be a part of it. My approach to &#8220;witnessing&#8221;, is to befriend everyone I meet, treat them with the respect and love that I know Christ would, and make myself available to help them if the need arises. That can be extending an invitation to help someone move or listening to someone tell me about the hard times they&#8217;re going through without trying to offer unwanted counsel. I really really look forward to the &#8220;letting out of bad blood&#8221; in the American Christian Church. What I mean by that is for those who are going to make a commitment to make it, but those who are not to be honest enough with themselves to admit that.  My best friends are not die-hard Christians. One is a stout atheist, but I love him, because he&#8217;s so honest it&#8217;s nothing short of refreshing. I would love to see church leadership just be honest about themselves. The people would follow suit. Instead we struggle to maintain the facade and it fools no one. We are no holier or better than the rest of society. That&#8217;s what I truly love about Christianity. It doesn&#8217;t demand perfection. It doesn&#8217;t demand performance.</p>
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		<title>By: sanityman</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-94</link>
		<dc:creator>sanityman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Dec 2007 01:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-94</guid>
		<description>All Christ believers are delusional.  You can try to separate your herd all you want, but dilineating dark-black from darker-black just  isn't doing it for me.

For the people with fully functioning brains who realize the scam and are calling you christ followers on it, well, you are all just part of the flock (of fools).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All Christ believers are delusional.  You can try to separate your herd all you want, but dilineating dark-black from darker-black just  isn&#8217;t doing it for me.</p>
<p>For the people with fully functioning brains who realize the scam and are calling you christ followers on it, well, you are all just part of the flock (of fools).</p>
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		<title>By: Lon</title>
		<link>http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/comment-page-1/#comment-93</link>
		<dc:creator>Lon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Dec 2007 00:30:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lrs.moonstar.com/blog/2007/12/05/no-wonder-atheists-make-fun-of-christians/#comment-93</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;@ElTigre&lt;/b&gt;: Your bit about anticipating a shift in Christianity falls very close to something I've been pondering myself. Perhaps it is a good thing that traditional orthodox Christianity is driving people away, especially towards a stance of reason and rationalism. I'm convinced that people's spiritual yearnings will serve to bring them back, seeking truth. But fortunately, they will have been raised with critical minds and a reliance upon independent thought and won't be so gullible as earlier theists are/were. They will come into it knowing better than to discard good science just because some preacher told them it was wrong. They will insist that, if they are going to believe in a God, that He &lt;i&gt;makes good sense&lt;/i&gt;, rather than blindly accepting a myriad inconsistencies and irrational suppositions.

I also like your point that one's life should provide evidence of one's belief in Jesus. It's the whole "by their fruits you shall know them" idea. I note that of all the Christians I've known and met, the ones I'd consider to be the most morally upright ones &lt;i&gt;never mentioned they were Christian&lt;/i&gt; ... I had to ask. It's to the point where I believe it's a warning flag if someone I've just met announces that they're Christian. If they were a true Christian, they wouldn't have to tell me, I'd notice on my own just by watching their dealings. The shady ones always loudly proclaim it, and then use it to justify something that smells awful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>@ElTigre</b>: Your bit about anticipating a shift in Christianity falls very close to something I&#8217;ve been pondering myself. Perhaps it is a good thing that traditional orthodox Christianity is driving people away, especially towards a stance of reason and rationalism. I&#8217;m convinced that people&#8217;s spiritual yearnings will serve to bring them back, seeking truth. But fortunately, they will have been raised with critical minds and a reliance upon independent thought and won&#8217;t be so gullible as earlier theists are/were. They will come into it knowing better than to discard good science just because some preacher told them it was wrong. They will insist that, if they are going to believe in a God, that He <i>makes good sense</i>, rather than blindly accepting a myriad inconsistencies and irrational suppositions.</p>
<p>I also like your point that one&#8217;s life should provide evidence of one&#8217;s belief in Jesus. It&#8217;s the whole &#8220;by their fruits you shall know them&#8221; idea. I note that of all the Christians I&#8217;ve known and met, the ones I&#8217;d consider to be the most morally upright ones <i>never mentioned they were Christian</i> &#8230; I had to ask. It&#8217;s to the point where I believe it&#8217;s a warning flag if someone I&#8217;ve just met announces that they&#8217;re Christian. If they were a true Christian, they wouldn&#8217;t have to tell me, I&#8217;d notice on my own just by watching their dealings. The shady ones always loudly proclaim it, and then use it to justify something that smells awful.</p>
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